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Post by rooster on Dec 10, 2017 12:31:01 GMT -5
Yesterday's UMass game is like last year's BC game - one bad non-conference loss.
It looks like this year we won't have any solid or "good" non-conference wins (maybe Washington, Belmont??) Hopefully like last year, the team can turn it around and go on a. once run - avoid DePaul losses, etc.
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Post by thumper on Dec 10, 2017 12:55:40 GMT -5
Thump deciding who's allowed to be a fan again......shocker. I don't see anyone bashing Cooley around here. Head scratcher on not getting Edwards in before Cartwright against brown for me but that's about it. He does get a ton of credit for being a superior talent evaluator which may need to be scaled back. The Jax and jr transfers are mind boggling from my seat. Hey Urinal cakes, I just said , reading Rock's post, that I'd welcome the departure of those that Rock referenced. But that wouldn't include you. You are a self-made legend around here. Part and parcel of Pro Boards. We all know negativity is part of your fundamental nature. You wouldn't be happy unless you pizz on someone's cornflakes. Your 2-3 year rant regarding perceived deficiencies of Jalen Lindsey is worthy of a study by someone trained in the psychological shortcomings of internet voyeurs. Someone more knowledgeable than myself. But simple reading is another thing. Bigsnoop was right. You do have a comprehension problem. I hope you get through this Christmas Season. I suggest watching and re-watching Dicken's "Christmas Carol". It might brighten your perspective on the Friars and your daily life in general. PIZZA, SODA, GRINDERS!!!
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Post by pcballboy on Dec 10, 2017 13:01:00 GMT -5
Thump deciding who's allowed to be a fan again......shocker. I don't see anyone bashing Cooley around here. Head scratcher on not getting Edwards in before Cartwright against brown for me but that's about it. He does get a ton of credit for being a superior talent evaluator which may need to be scaled back. The Jax and jr transfers are mind boggling from my seat. Hey Urinal cakes, I just said , reading Rock's post, that I'd welcome the departure of those that Rock referenced. But that wouldn't include you. You are a self-made legend around here. Part and parcel of Pro Boards. We all know negativity is part of your fundamental nature. You wouldn't be happy unless you could hiss on someone's cornflakes. Your 2-3 year rant regarding perceived deficiencies of Jalen Lindsey is worthy of a study by someone trained in the psychological shortcomings of internet voyeurs. Someone more knowledgeable than myself. But simple reading is another thing. Bigsnoop was right. You do have a comprehension problem. I hope you get through this Christmas Season. I suggest watching and re-watching Dicken's "Christmas Carol". It might brighten your perspective on the Friars and your daily life in general. PIZZA, SODA, GRINDERS!!! love it, but i hope he does not make it through the xmas season.
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Post by Rock on Dec 10, 2017 14:27:15 GMT -5
I think a more useful dialogue here would be to explore why it seems that EC and staff are seemingly late each season getting it together. Now, some of that has been injury's over the years, no doubt, but the big stumbles in the fall don't seem nearly as frequent once we hit winter (the BE in other words). We have far more BC, Brown and Umass performances than we do a DePaul disasters. I have speculated on this for a few years now, suggesting that Ed does not settle on the right rotation soon enough, burying better options early and then letting them emerge later (Jackson was that guy last year). Why is that? Does he play too deep a bench during the fall (recruiting period) to satisfy promises or show would-be targets that they will get a chance? Or does he simply have too many similarly skilled players and now it's just a puzzle to be built, right pieces, right spots and that takes awhile? The value of using PT to motivate a deep roster may not be better than letting guys play through things as you do with thin rosters, it's a classic motivation vs confidence equation. Often times less is more. Depth can strange some coaches. In the end, I think you can be a bubble team, 1 out of 3 year NCAA qualifier with top 125 talent but it takes top-50 guys to overcome what Ed is facing now. He had that with Dunn (and Bentil, who played to top-50 level) and he'll have it next year with Duke and Reeves joining MAL but right now he seems to have a collection of middle relievers - and too many to decide who gets the 5th inning and who gets the 7th so guys play with scattered motivation and confidence. Or maybe not.
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Post by johnnypc on Dec 10, 2017 14:36:28 GMT -5
Early on, I believe it is trying to find the pieces that fit together. Also when you play a lot of guys early it helps decide who can help later in the year. It is very difficult try to figure out who can play when you are playing each other in practice . The product coach puts on the floor can be greater than, equal to or less than the sum of its parts.
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Post by thewalk on Dec 10, 2017 14:44:57 GMT -5
I think a more useful dialogue here would be to explore why it seems that EC and staff are seemingly late each season getting it together....this is the first that I can remember when we haven't had major question marks going in. Even with Holt, I was expecting a start comparable to Xavier or SHU. Isn't Xavier playing the group that lost a crap ton in a row down the stretch and barely got in? SHU lost their PG?
He didn't say it....but he said it....he relied on the seniors to get this team ready.
And Thump - let's just say Jalen hasn't been the leader that we need this year. Fair?
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Post by Rock on Dec 10, 2017 15:34:03 GMT -5
I think a more useful dialogue here would be to explore why it seems that EC and staff are seemingly late each season getting it together....this is the first that I can remember when we haven't had major question marks going in. Even with Holt, I was expecting a start comparable to Xavier or SHU. Isn't Xavier playing the group that lost a crap ton in a row down the stretch and barely got in? SHU lost their PG? He didn't say it....but he said it....he relied on the seniors to get this team ready. And Thump - let's just say Jalen hasn't been the leader that we need this year. Fair? I expected us to be very good in the fall too, even without Holt who now seems like he must have been Lebron James and I just failed to notice. Our seniors are proving to be "play me, don't expose me" kind of "leaders", guys much better driving from the back seat. That is the personality of some and in Bullock and Lindsey they personify it. KC can take the wheel but seems like his injury is preventing that. I'm also gonna go all Bill Belichick right now and ask if basketball is just not that important to those two guys? You can lack some skills and talent and have issues like you mention with Xavier but give me a group of upperclassman where basketball is the 2nd most important thing in their life and I'll win with them most days. Maybe we lack that. I'd have no idea of knowing if that is the case but it's worth considering.
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Post by thewalk on Dec 10, 2017 16:26:20 GMT -5
..add in year 4 of hearing Ed....no sham to nudge along those summer workouts....and you very well may have our issue...
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Post by thumper on Dec 10, 2017 19:14:56 GMT -5
I think a more useful dialogue here would be to explore why it seems that EC and staff are seemingly late each season getting it together. Now, some of that has been injury's over the years, no doubt, but the big stumbles in the fall don't seem nearly as frequent once we hit winter (the BE in other words). We have far more BC, Brown and Umass performances than we do a DePaul disasters. I have speculated on this for a few years now, suggesting that Ed does not settle on the right rotation soon enough, burying better options early and then letting them emerge later (Jackson was that guy last year). Why is that? Does he play too deep a bench during the fall (recruiting period) to satisfy promises or show would-be targets that they will get a chance? Or does he simply have too many similarly skilled players and now it's just a puzzle to be built, right pieces, right spots and that takes awhile? The value of using PT to motivate a deep roster may not be better than letting guys play through things as you do with thin rosters, it's a classic motivation vs confidence equation. Often times less is more. Depth can strange some coaches. In the end, I think you can be a bubble team, 1 out of 3 year NCAA qualifier with top 125 talent but it takes top-50 guys to overcome what Ed is facing now. He had that with Dunn (and Bentil, who played to top-50 level) and he'll have it next year with Duke and Reeves joining MAL but right now he seems to have a collection of middle relievers - and too many to decide who gets the 5th inning and who gets the 7th so guys play with scattered motivation and confidence. Or maybe not. Rock, We are coming off an historic accomplishment of the Friars under Ed Cooley ... four straight NCAA appearances. Cut the freakin guy some slack!!! We lost our starting center and have suffered numerous injuries beyond that. We beat Washington (who beat #2 Kansas at Kansas) and buried BC who beat #1 Duke. Yes, it hasn't been pretty and we should be better than 7-3 but we aren't. The coach lives and works with our Friars (unlike our many experts working a keyboard). I suggest we let him do his job. And, by the way, there's some more basketball to be played this year. You're better than some of the denigrating sludge that alleges to be fans. GO PC. GO FRIARS!!! PIZZA, SODA, GRINDERS!!!
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Post by Rock on Dec 11, 2017 7:55:07 GMT -5
I think a more useful dialogue here would be to explore why it seems that EC and staff are seemingly late each season getting it together. Now, some of that has been injury's over the years, no doubt, but the big stumbles in the fall don't seem nearly as frequent once we hit winter (the BE in other words). We have far more BC, Brown and Umass performances than we do a DePaul disasters. I have speculated on this for a few years now, suggesting that Ed does not settle on the right rotation soon enough, burying better options early and then letting them emerge later (Jackson was that guy last year). Why is that? Does he play too deep a bench during the fall (recruiting period) to satisfy promises or show would-be targets that they will get a chance? Or does he simply have too many similarly skilled players and now it's just a puzzle to be built, right pieces, right spots and that takes awhile? The value of using PT to motivate a deep roster may not be better than letting guys play through things as you do with thin rosters, it's a classic motivation vs confidence equation. Often times less is more. Depth can strange some coaches. In the end, I think you can be a bubble team, 1 out of 3 year NCAA qualifier with top 125 talent but it takes top-50 guys to overcome what Ed is facing now. He had that with Dunn (and Bentil, who played to top-50 level) and he'll have it next year with Duke and Reeves joining MAL but right now he seems to have a collection of middle relievers - and too many to decide who gets the 5th inning and who gets the 7th so guys play with scattered motivation and confidence. Or maybe not. Rock, We are coming off an historic accomplishment of the Friars under Ed Cooley ... four straight NCAA appearances. Cut the freakin guy some slack!!! We lost our starting center and have suffered numerous injuries beyond that. We beat Washington (who beat #2 Kansas at Kansas) and buried BC who beat #1 Duke. Yes, it hasn't been pretty and we should be better than 7-3 but we aren't. The coach lives and works with our Friars (unlike our many experts working a keyboard). I suggest we let him do his job. And, by the way, there's some more basketball to be played this year. You're better than some of the denigrating sludge that alleges to be fans. GO PC. GO FRIARS!!! PIZZA, SODA, GRINDERS!!! "Cut the freakin' guy some slack". Not sure I haven't done that. Honestly, am I any more questioning of Ed than he has been of himself? I think my observations have been fair-handed and reasonable. I fully understand what EC has done for the program and I don't think it makes me less of a fan to discuss how the staff might be better. That I have simultaneity drawn fire from both you and walk in the same thread speaks to some degree of objectivity on my part, does it not?..............or at the very least is worthy of my obituary one day.
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mikemc
Friar Fanatic
Posts: 3,241
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Post by mikemc on Dec 11, 2017 8:01:07 GMT -5
Don't worry, we are not the only "soft team" in the NCAA. Bill Self has proclaimed KU to be the softest team he has ever coached!
....gotta love friartown...
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Post by TheInfoMan on Dec 11, 2017 17:49:33 GMT -5
Somehow young and Jackson regressed. Watson with some monster dunks, friars playing better and nursing a fragile lead with 10 to go. Heres where games are won or lost. Young's 0-pts, 1-reb, 1-blk and 1-T/O in 20-minutes is pathetic. He was my sentimental favorite player last year, but now I advocate benching him and starting Watson, or perhaps moving Bullock to center. I also advocate our shopping for a 2018 center, a JUCO center or perhaps a transfer. Note my demeanor change.
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Post by thewalk on Dec 11, 2017 18:47:59 GMT -5
transfers from Kentucky should be on the radar....
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Post by thumper on Dec 11, 2017 18:58:26 GMT -5
Somehow young and Jackson regressed. Watson with some monster dunks, friars playing better and nursing a fragile lead with 10 to go. Heres where games are won or lost. Young's 0-pts, 1-reb, 1-blk and 1-T/O in 20-minutes is pathetic. He was my sentimental favorite player last year, but now I advocate benching him and starting Watson, or perhaps moving Bullock to center. I also advocate our shopping for a 2018 center, a JUCO center or perhaps a transfer. Note my demeanor change. Everyone can rant and rave that the season has fallen apart, that all players have pimples, that Ed is to be questioned ... but I say let the season unwind, let Ed do his job (the one where he's taken the Friars to four straight NCAA ... something they've never done in their history). I don't think benching is the answer for Young or Watson. They are learning on the job. Young came out strong against Brown (5 rebounds and 6 points in 11 first half minutes while Watson was MIA with 1 rebound and 2 points in 9 first half minutes). Watson was slightly better against UMass with 5 points but only 1 rebound and Young was MIA in this game. But two of our next 3 games are against Stony Brook and Sacred Heart. No benching just lots of minutes for both! PIZZA, SODA, GRINDERS!!!
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