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Post by connfriar on Sept 29, 2017 8:25:06 GMT -5
Just heard on Louisville sports radio that more sordid details in the FBI investigation will be coming out today (the hosts implied that this means other schools being tainted/implicated)...
Who's up for a late-Friday news dump??
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Post by wtm97 on Sept 29, 2017 8:39:02 GMT -5
Of course Conn - and among the many articles written, one was most revealing...saying in effect the "shock" expressed, (and to be expressed), across college basketball center(s) around "We didn't know any of this was illegal"
Huh?
Sadly the real victims, in so many ways, are the exploited athletes and families - even as they took $$$ - lured by a quick buck then "owned" by those buying them.
Bought on the cheap then tossed aside when things don't work out OR under the thumb of the corrupters as they control them.
This investigation is bring spearheaded by the NY Feds, the famous launching ground of so many eager beavers, (Rudy Guliani, Louis Free, etc.) And when they smell blood they are sharks...they smell blood and the "I knew nothing" defense will not fly here...
This has been a two year undercover FBI sting and they have discovered a world of out of control greed - fertile ground to exploit - how far they go is in their control meaning they have the power, not the NCAA, not the coaches, not the colleges...
Since this sleaze permeates the whole world of college revenue sports, it could upend many and is potentially unending...suggest a brokered deal will emerge after a bloodletting.
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Post by connfriar on Sept 29, 2017 9:00:40 GMT -5
Well said...let's hope the investigation also leads to Bristol...
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Post by dex on Sept 29, 2017 9:03:13 GMT -5
If by "brokered deal" you mean the NCAA being required to be a guardian of their sports rather than a stooge for the elites and apparel sleazebags, I am all for it. They have demonstrated they can't govern without mandates and guidelines by a watchdog. Mark Emmert should get the ball rolling by resigning. Hopefully his successor will issue the most harsh sanctions ever against a crooked program like UNC and DadGum Roy.
I am sorry it has come to this point but the tail has been wagging the dog for too long.
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Post by wtm97 on Sept 29, 2017 9:32:26 GMT -5
Well yes dex...
Guessing the economic impact of a totally destructive purge will drive such an "accommodation", after a showtime bloodletting...
Take Louisville as just one example - since they are the current soup de jour. The YUM center is heavily mortgaged with the U of L, the city and taxpayers burdened with a huge bond debt...and that is but one local problem; and further exposed programs will impact many others - the NCAA and the cash cow of March Madness is the Holy Grail for everybody meaning EVERYBODY.
Since $$$ drove this mess into the current collision; $$$ will necessitate a solution set after the splash settles and the ambitious US Attorneys make their bones.
How far this goes remains to be seen - hopefully reform and controls are forced - then enforced once the crime scene is mopped up...
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Post by bigsnoop on Sept 29, 2017 11:05:07 GMT -5
Well yes dex... Guessing the economic impact of a totally destructive purge will drive such an "accommodation", after a showtime bloodletting... Take Louisville as just one example - since they are the current soup de jour. The YUM center is heavily mortgaged with the U of L, the city and taxpayers burdened with a huge bond debt...and that is but one local problem; The Yum Center and University of Louisville finances is going to be a major issue going forward. The university has an incredibly beneficial lease deal (including exclusive use of the facility for the men's and women's basketball teams for practice during the ACC season) which has made it nearly impossible for the arena to pay its debt service. They have told the university and the city that unless the terms change and the rent is increased dramatically, they will default on the debt and declare bankruptcy. Additionally, the university had a $50 million dollar bailout from the state, which is less likely to be repeated this year. They have a hiring freeze, which has led to courses being cut and increased class size, and their situation is getting worse. Their endowment has lost about 40% of its value in recent years. It will be interesting to see if they can afford another top coach, especially if they have to pay settlements to Pitino and Jurich
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Post by craigl79 on Sept 29, 2017 11:34:02 GMT -5
Some random thoughts on the mega scandal.
1. Going forward head coaches are really going to think about what kind of assistant coaches they want representing them and their program. Pitino went from having assistants like Herb Sendek, Stu Jackson, Billy Donovan et al to the garbage he has on his staff now.
2. That is not to say that the head coaches aren't responsible or didn't know what was going on. Pitino certainly did. But some head coaches didn't however. It says in the affidavit that they targeted assistant coaches because the head coaches make to much money to accept bribes.
3. Speaking about making too much money what on Earth is Chuck Person, who made 23 million dollars in the NBA, doing taking bribes? They should throw away the key on him.
4. A lot of the talking heads are asking what is the ultimate solution to this problem. I think the solution is already here. By the time the FBI gets through with this investigation most coaches and players will not think of taking a bribe. They never thought in a million years that the FBI would get involved.
5. I surely hope the feds wind up going hard after the sneaker companies themselves. A couple of three hundred or four hundred million dollar fines ought to get them thinking
6. Does anyone think that the Nike, Adidas, and Under Armour CEO's didn't know what is going on? Let's hope the FBI can prove it.
7. Want to know where to start looking? If I was the FBI I would take a real close look at the Nike AAU programs whose kids only go to Nike colleges. The same with Adidas and Under Armour AAU programs. Something is wrong if all schools don't have a shot at your kids.
8. The NBA currently has between 450-500 players. I wonder how many of them took some sneaker money before they became professional.
9. Watch out college football. College basketball may be at the plate but you are on deck.
10. It would be interesting to see which college basketball staffs have been out recruiting this week and which staffs have been hunkering down in meetings formulating game plans.
11. Don't forget that there is a certain segment of college basketball that is clean and is secretly cheering the FBI on right now.
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Post by TheInfoMan on Sept 29, 2017 11:46:41 GMT -5
Some random thoughts on the mega scandal. 2. That is not to say that the head coaches aren't responsible or didn't know what was going on. Pitino certainly did. But some head coaches didn't however. It says in the affidavit that they targeted assistant coaches because the head coaches make to much money to accept bribes. 5. I surely hope the feds wind up going hard after the sneaker companies themselves. A couple of three hundred or four hundred million dollar fines ought to get them thinking All good questions Craig!! Some thoughts: 2) If head coaches make too much money to accept a bribe, it makes them more likely to give a bribe. I hope that likelihood will get equal scrutiny. 5) With that, I guess outrageous sneaker prices won't be coming down anytime soon. Anybody still have $7.99 Keds or PF Flyers in their basements?
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Post by suspended poster on Sept 29, 2017 11:52:22 GMT -5
Some random thoughts on the mega scandal. 1. Going forward head coaches are really going to think about what kind of assistant coaches they want representing them and their program. Pitino went from having assistants like Herb Sendek, Stu Jackson, Billy Donovan et al to the garbage he has on his staff now. 2. That is not to say that the head coaches aren't responsible or didn't know what was going on. Pitino certainly did. But some head coaches didn't however. It says in the affidavit that they targeted assistant coaches because the head coaches make to much money to accept bribes. 3. Speaking about making too much money what on Earth is Chuck Person, who made 23 million dollars in the NBA, doing taking bribes? They should throw away the key on him. 4. A lot of the talking heads are asking what is the ultimate solution to this problem. I think the solution is already here. By the time the FBI gets through with this investigation most coaches and players will not think of taking a bribe. They never thought in a million years that the FBI would get involved. 5. I surely hope the feds wind up going hard after the sneaker companies themselves. A couple of three hundred or four hundred million dollar fines ought to get them thinking 6. Does anyone think that the Nike, Adidas, and Under Armour CEO's didn't know what is going on? Let's hope the FBI can prove it. 7. Want to know where to start looking? If I was the FBI I would take a real close look at the Nike AAU programs whose kids only go to Nike colleges. The same with Adidas and Under Armour AAU programs. Something is wrong if all schools don't have a shot at your kids. 8. The NBA currently has between 450-500 players. I wonder how many of them took some sneaker money before they became professional. 9. Watch out college football. College basketball may be at the plate but you are on deck. 10. It would be interesting to see which college basketball staffs have been out recruiting this week and which staffs have been hunkering down in meetings formulating game plans. 11. Don't forget that there is a certain segment of college basketball that is clean and is secretly cheering the FBI on right now. That certain segment is called the Ivy and Patriot Leagues. Bill Carmody, Joe Jones,and Mike Martin must be ecstatic
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Post by dex on Sept 29, 2017 13:35:12 GMT -5
NCAA pres Mark Emmert: "We have no tolerance whatsoever for this alleged behavior."
I have called for this moron's resignation.
I do NOT call for him to be prosecuted and jailed.
Why you ask? Glad you did.
I think he's mentally unbalanced to the extent that electric-shock therapy is in order.
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Post by Rock on Sept 29, 2017 13:46:04 GMT -5
The anger in this should be directed squarely at the most corrupt, illicit, money-grabbing, unethical enterprise in the entire US economy today: colleges and universities. These rackets enjoy tax-free status, hold trillions of dollars in endowments (while graduating only 50% of their "customers") and create trillions in debt to young people across the country. THEN, THEN they accept millions of dollars from private shoe companies for nothing more than clothing rights. These criminals would make the Wall Street MBS traders of 2008 blush.
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Post by friarbrown on Sept 29, 2017 14:51:21 GMT -5
The shoes companies should be barred from AAU . They are some of the biggest culprits. They get free advertisement from outfitting programs and they pour hundreds of thousands of dollars into programs yearly. A lot of coaches use these kids and they try to hold on for life. AAU is a full time job for many of these guys and for every good coach who does it right there are 10 who don't. Look at what Mike did to Isaiah Washington at Minnesota. He and some of his friends created something called "jellyfam" and they use the grape emoji as their symbol. All of a sudden Nike has shoes coming out with grape emojis on them. These kids see this and they know they are being used to sell shoes for free. No wonder people take bribes. Not saying it's right but it's understandable.
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Post by dex on Sept 29, 2017 15:25:00 GMT -5
One suggestion that I think I read in Doyell's piece is to not allow college coaches to recruit at aau events or home gyms. Recruiting would be limited to High School and Prep school games and open gyms.
The aau people will tell you that will be the end of their programs and the kids won't be playing after the school year...at least in organized leagues. They will also tell you at a minimum you can forget the travel to away games. Sponsorship is key to their existence is what you will hear. I don't know how much they get in membership fees and private donations from community benefactors. I'm sure the system can be improved to make it less crooked. However money is still the root of all evil and undue influence, Perhaps the ncaa can help fund these organizations...IDK.
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Post by craigl79 on Sept 29, 2017 16:41:39 GMT -5
One suggestion that I think I read in Doyell's piece is to not allow college coaches to recruit at aau events or home gyms. Recruiting would be limited to High School and Prep school games and open gyms. The aau people will tell you that will be the end of their programs and the kids won't be playing after the school year...at least in organized leagues. They will also tell you at a minimum you can forget the travel to away games. Sponsorship is key to their existence is what you will hear. I don't know how much they get in membership fees and private donations from community benefactors. I'm sure the system can be improved to make it less crooked. However money is still the root of all evil and undue influence, Perhaps the ncaa can help fund these organizations...IDK. It is a very good idea Dex. For it to really work you would have to figure out a way of keeping out the really big sneaker money out of the top high schools. This would be particularly difficult with the Prep schools.
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Post by dex on Sept 29, 2017 18:08:49 GMT -5
I can't devote my remaining years to these intricate solutions. If you believe like me that Money makes the world go round...then a funding mechanism must be found. Without funds facilities go away, equipment goes away, refs go away, travel goes away, administration goes away and quality coaches are less inclined to work in these programs.
The result is an inferior product, namely the players who won't be instructed properly nor will they get the PT and competition to improve.
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