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Post by dmac80 on Jan 4, 2014 22:11:19 GMT -5
What a pathetic collection of commentary on this. It's incredible to me. Austin escapes indictment here because PC took it's time considering a reversal of its original verdict to wipe him out for the year. Yet, nobody indicts Austin over his behavior? what behavior? We don't know because the school and it's lawyers are hiding behind "privacy laws". All we have are that the police were never involved. Rumors suggest an ALLEGATION was made against the players. Innocent until proven guilty usually reigns, except in one specific area of society where the ALLEGED are automatically assumed guilty. This is what happens to BA in my opinion. After all, if evidence were there of a felony, you can bet the police would have been called. They weren't even contacted. Why not? What young man, especially a minority from the inner city would now want to come to PC and get screwed over like BA? I'm thoroughly against school administrators investigating ALLEGED felonies. I think if the police weren't involved I have a hard time believing the verdict of school administrators. They're the least logical and common sense oriented people on earth, save maybe politicians.
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Post by Rock on Jan 4, 2014 22:24:56 GMT -5
Im assuming that most here are primarily concerned with the impact this will all have with Cooley; either in his ability to recruit or our ability to keep him here. Let's face it, if he's unable to recruit or ends up bolting because of this it will be pretty clear that the market has ruled PC to have been wrong in its treatment of Austin. And if that is the case we have effectively chosen not to be a BE level program and we should all dry up and go away accordingly. I don't think that's gonna happen but that's the goal posts as I see them right now and, like many, I'm standing under them watching closely.
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mikemc
Friar Fanatic
Posts: 3,240
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Post by mikemc on Jan 4, 2014 22:26:25 GMT -5
"But I had come to the conclusion, prior to tonight's announcement, that the school and its image as a Catholic institution is more important than its basketball team, Brandon Austin and Ed Cooley."
I have been told on numerous occasions that in order for the basketball team to become relevant was to have a coach bigger than the program.. Doesn't look that way now>>>>
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Post by pc1971 on Jan 4, 2014 22:29:34 GMT -5
I agree with much of what Rock says.
However,I have never heard a bad word in Philly from opposing coaches and others who know Brandon Austin well.I have spoken with several and all have told me that Brandon is a good kid.Rock's is the first negative I had heard from anyone from his pre-PC time.Frankly,I do not buy it as being true.We know others have had negatives with themselves prior to coming to PC and we heard about them beforehand in many circumstances.Sidiki is one easy one to mention.
This whole situation really upsets me and makes no sense.
I believe it will have serious ramifications with the staff,future recruiting,the perception of the Program and dollars to the school.PC has the right to do whatever it wants.But,it needs to be ready to suffer the consequences .Not a happy camper right now.
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peeps
Signed LOI
Posts: 224
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Post by peeps on Jan 4, 2014 22:30:42 GMT -5
allegedly the administration wanted the girl and two ballplayers expelled. so instead... bullock is suspended for the year, austin transfers, and absolutely nothing happens to the girl.
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Post by friarfaithful on Jan 4, 2014 22:38:44 GMT -5
Do any of you know, for sure, what happened? I mean....100% sure. Not from your "sources" or from other students or rumors or speculation. Does anybody on this board know what the heck really happened?
Well, if you don't know for sure, then just shut up. You're guessing and reacting to a guess is childish and stupid.
If and when you have the facts, then react. You know....when you actually have the facts.
BTW, if it turns out that Providence College acted according to it's Catholic values and these values are applied universally to it's student body then good for them. I'd be more proud to be a graduate of Providence College if they stood by their Catholic values and lost an additional game or two versus abandoning their Catholic identity and winning a National title.
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Post by Rock on Jan 4, 2014 22:39:29 GMT -5
What a pathetic collection of commentary on this. It's incredible to me. Austin escapes indictment here because PC took it's time considering a reversal of its original verdict to wipe him out for the year. Yet, nobody indicts Austin over his behavior? what behavior? We don't know because the school and it's lawyers are hiding behind "privacy laws". All we have are that the police were never involved. Rumors suggest an ALLEGATION was made against the players. Innocent until proven guilty usually reigns, except in one specific area of society where the ALLEGED are automatically assumed guilty. This is what happens to BA in my opinion. After all, if evidence were there of a felony, you can bet the police would have been called. They weren't even contacted. Why not? What young man, especially a minority from the inner city would now want to come to PC and get screwed over like BA? I'm thoroughly against school administrators investigating ALLEGED felonies. I think if the police weren't involved I have a hard time believing the verdict of school administrators. They're the least logical and common sense oriented people on earth, save maybe politicians. Dmac, that the incident hasn't been disclosed does not mean it remains merely an allegation. It's been alleged and found to be true. You and I may disagree with the punishment but by all accounts the verdict is solid. I find it interesting that "the core" as walk affectionately calls them is solidly against the PC administration on this by what I'm reading. That group seems genuinely upset and that says something to me even if I, again, think this is all heat of the moment stuff. So unfortunate. All losers, no winners in this mess.
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mikemc
Friar Fanatic
Posts: 3,240
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Post by mikemc on Jan 4, 2014 22:45:52 GMT -5
So, a true allegation, but not a criminal action warrants a 1 year suspension??? No way in hell we can compete playing by those rules in the long run.. It leads to further player attrition and a hit on future recruiting. The hoops team needs to be off campus if pre marital sex is worthy of a 1 year suspension. Feed them saltpeter?
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Post by dmac80 on Jan 4, 2014 22:54:36 GMT -5
Do any of you know, for sure, what happened? I mean....100% sure. Not from your "sources" or from other students or rumors or speculation. Does anybody on this board know what the heck really happened? Well, if you don't know for sure, then just shut up. You're guessing and reacting to a guess is childish and stupid. If and when you have the facts, then react. You know....when you actually have the facts. BTW, if it turns out that Providence College acted according to it's Catholic values and these values are applied universally to it's student body then good for them. I'd be more proud to be a graduate of Providence College if they stood by their Catholic values and lost an additional game or two versus abandoning their Catholic identity and winning a National title. One thing we know, the police were not only uninvolved, they were never even contacted about the incident. This is public knowledge per the Providence Journal. Explain that and explain what justified a 2 month "investigation" run by school administrators (not detectives) followed by a year long suspension from basketball for these two athletes. I've been waiting for that answer since the 'decision' and have yet to hear a single scenario that justifies it. So no, we won't shut up. Btw, if we are going with the premise a crime was not committed but the school has stood by "Catholic values" in suspending these guys, then we might as well suspend every student athlete and expel every student engaged in behavior that violates "Catholic values" which would be virtually all of them.
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mikemc
Friar Fanatic
Posts: 3,240
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Post by mikemc on Jan 4, 2014 23:01:18 GMT -5
Does anyone here think that if these kids deserved to be kicked off the team, Cooley wouldn't have done it himself?? This is what I'm having a difficult time with. If the action was worthy of the punishment and Cooley fought against the punishment, wouldn't we have an issue with the coach and his morals??
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Post by dmac80 on Jan 4, 2014 23:03:55 GMT -5
what behavior? We don't know because the school and it's lawyers are hiding behind "privacy laws". All we have are that the police were never involved. Rumors suggest an ALLEGATION was made against the players. Innocent until proven guilty usually reigns, except in one specific area of society where the ALLEGED are automatically assumed guilty. This is what happens to BA in my opinion. After all, if evidence were there of a felony, you can bet the police would have been called. They weren't even contacted. Why not? What young man, especially a minority from the inner city would now want to come to PC and get screwed over like BA? I'm thoroughly against school administrators investigating ALLEGED felonies. I think if the police weren't involved I have a hard time believing the verdict of school administrators. They're the least logical and common sense oriented people on earth, save maybe politicians. Dmac, that the incident hasn't been disclosed does not mean it remains merely an allegation. It's been alleged and found to be true. You and I may disagree with the punishment but by all accounts the verdict is solid. I find it interesting that "the core" as walk affectionately calls them is solidly against the PC administration on this by what I'm reading. That group seems genuinely upset and that says something to me even if I, again, think this is all heat of the moment stuff. So unfortunate. All losers, no winners in this mess. Found true? By who? School administrators trained in investigating felonies? Unbelievably scary that you'd trust these people You'd feel comfortable with your son in the hands of these warped people, driven by political correctness and avoiding the strongest perceived threats of lawsuits, not getting justice in an ALLEGED serious crime? Police should be investigating serious felonious allegations on campus, not pencil pushing school administrators with political agendas. I believe nothing coming from these people in such matters. Nothing.
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Post by friarfaithful on Jan 4, 2014 23:08:08 GMT -5
Do any of you know, for sure, what happened? I mean....100% sure. Not from your "sources" or from other students or rumors or speculation. Does anybody on this board know what the heck really happened? Well, if you don't know for sure, then just shut up. You're guessing and reacting to a guess is childish and stupid. If and when you have the facts, then react. You know....when you actually have the facts. BTW, if it turns out that Providence College acted according to it's Catholic values and these values are applied universally to it's student body then good for them. I'd be more proud to be a graduate of Providence College if they stood by their Catholic values and lost an additional game or two versus abandoning their Catholic identity and winning a National title. One thing we know, the police were not only uninvolved, they were never even contacted about the incident. This is public knowledge per the Providence Journal. Explain that and explain what justified a 2 month "investigation" run by school administrators (not detectives) followed by a year long suspension from basketball for these two athletes. I've been waiting for that answer since the 'decision' and have yet to hear a single scenario that justifies it. So no, we won't shut up. So what you "know" is that the Providence Police didn't get involved.....and? What exactly does that prove? Unless you're saying that the only thing that should get a student dismissed from Providence College is a crime. So cheating would be ok with you? You're not owed an asnwer nor should the College give you one (or any other fan for that matter). The law is quite clear and if they violate the law they can be sued. Educate yourself...take a read: "The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law that protects the privacy of student education records. The law applies to all schools that receive funds under an applicable program of the U.S. Department of Education. Generally, schools must have written permission from the parent or eligible student in order to release any information from a student's education record" www.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.htmlSo you believe the school should release the information to satisfy you and fans like you so they can open themselves up to a huge lawsuit. Brilliant....simply brilliant.
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Post by Rock on Jan 4, 2014 23:11:55 GMT -5
Mike, I hate all this, just like you do but Cooley is gonna pull for his guys to play, just like any coach. But the proper placement of checks & balances involves a student tribunal and the schools administration and they came together - apparently - to make this ruling. Think about it, they did this against potential financial gains and against the image and concerns of their signature sports program and highest paid, most marketable employee. That must have been hard to do. Real hard. I keep defaulting to what our BE bothers would have done in a similar situation to adjudicate all this in my own mind. I'm not going to get that answer so my frustration, like yours, is strong, real strong. Gotta be more to this story than we know. Sucks no matter how you look at it.
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Post by dmac80 on Jan 4, 2014 23:15:06 GMT -5
One thing we know, the police were not only uninvolved, they were never even contacted about the incident. This is public knowledge per the Providence Journal. Explain that and explain what justified a 2 month "investigation" run by school administrators (not detectives) followed by a year long suspension from basketball for these two athletes. I've been waiting for that answer since the 'decision' and have yet to hear a single scenario that justifies it. So no, we won't shut up. So what you "know" is that the Providence Police didn't get involved.....and? What exactly does that prove? Unless you're saying that the only thing that should get a student dismissed from Providence College is a crime. So cheating would be ok with you? You're not owed an asnwer nor should the College give you one (or any other fan for that matter). The law is quite clear and if they violate the law they can be sued. Educate yourself...take a read: "The Family Educational Rights and Privacy Act (FERPA) (20 U.S.C. § 1232g; 34 CFR Part 99) is a Federal law that protects the privacy of student education records. The law applies to all schools that receive funds under an applicable program of the U.S. Department of Education. Generally, schools must have written permission from the parent or eligible student in order to release any information from a student's education record" www.ed.gov/policy/gen/guid/fpco/ferpa/index.htmlSo you believe the school should release the information to satisfy you and fans like you so they can open themselves up to a huge lawsuit. Brilliant....simply brilliant. Nope I don't need to know anything, other than that a crime was not committed, since no police - Providence or Rhode Island State police were involved. (projo reported both denying any contact with school). Unless there is some other law enforcement entity that I'm forgetting??? This is called common sense. If a murder happened on PCs campus would you same folks be hiding behind the "student handbook" in saying the school can do its own thing and not contact police. Of course not. In this case we can surmise a crime, at least a felony, was either not committed or there was weak evidence of such, thus the school kept it "in house". That's all I need to know. Now we have lost a top 50 recruit. I hope he goes on to have a strong career. And I hope he sues the school for millions, as other railroaded athletes have been doing when accused of felonies that never make it to police but they are given significant penalties from school boards using much lower standards of presumption of innocence than the court system.
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mikemc
Friar Fanatic
Posts: 3,240
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Post by mikemc on Jan 4, 2014 23:19:11 GMT -5
I hear you Rock, I probably shouldn't be posting after a few Jameson 15 yr. I am just tired of the continuous attrition of players. It's been going on for so long and we are at a near breaking point with losing players..
I just don't have the same faith in the admin/church in the handling of these types of matters as other do.
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